Given the importance to the Society of recruiting children of existing JWs due to the increasing failure of ministry work in a more educated and informaed population do not expect any help or sympathy from them.
Frazzled UBM
JoinedPosts by Frazzled UBM
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28
Question for Current or Former Elders (baptism of minors)
by Michelle365 ini have joint custody of my two children with my ex husband who is still raising the kids on his time as jws.
my 11 year old claims she is getting baptized at the next assembly.
i have heard that i can write a letter to the boe and say that i oppose her getting baptized before she is 18. is that true?
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28
Question for Current or Former Elders (baptism of minors)
by Michelle365 ini have joint custody of my two children with my ex husband who is still raising the kids on his time as jws.
my 11 year old claims she is getting baptized at the next assembly.
i have heard that i can write a letter to the boe and say that i oppose her getting baptized before she is 18. is that true?
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Frazzled UBM
Michelle - from my limited experience I would say FIGHT with everyhting you've got. Try to get an injunction on the basis of potential breach of the chidl custody orders. It is outrageous that children below the age of 18 are indoctrinated into commiting to what amounts to an almost contractual arrangemetn to obey the Society and be subject to its draconian judicial processes. Do everyhting you can to protect your kids from being captured while they are too young to know what they are getting into and trust in their father's misguided direction.
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How to stay married to a born-in JW?
by Frazzled UBM init is hard to work out where to begin.
i have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what i have got myself into but i alos have no intention of getting out.
i love my wife dearly but in the 9 years i ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married i have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the society is not what it claims to be but to no avail.
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Frazzled UBM
Also Lisa Rose you are right about the importance of showing the positive side of human nature (I believe that while humans are self-interested they are also capable of great compassion and kindness) so I went out of my way to point out all the acts of kindness and bravery during the big storm that hit New Jersey and new York last year to try to undermine the ngegative characterisation fo the Society and when the news talks about a drop in crime levels I am quick to repeat it to her. I also point out the fact that we are living in an unparalleled period of peace contrary to what the Society says (are any of you old enough to remember the Society referring to the US and Soviet Uniotn during the Cold War as the two princes who would cause a major world war and were harbingers of Aremageddon. That was all conveniently forgotten when the Cold War ended). Unfortunately we were in Tokyo when the big earthquake and tsunami hit in 2011 so that had an impactg on her and my reference to earthquake stats to show this was not outside the historical experience made no impact...again
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21
How to stay married to a born-in JW?
by Frazzled UBM init is hard to work out where to begin.
i have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what i have got myself into but i alos have no intention of getting out.
i love my wife dearly but in the 9 years i ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married i have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the society is not what it claims to be but to no avail.
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Frazzled UBM
Fernando - Ah yes the socratic method - being a lawyer by training I am well-schooled in this. I put the following questions to my wife 'How can you be sure the Society is who they say they are? What is the basis for their authority as Jehovah's mouthpiece? How were they appointed, including what was the original appointment and how did the succession work?' First response was 'That is very difficult to answer.' My response was 'This is critical to your belief that you know the Truth so you must know the answer.' After that only silence. I have no idea whether it made any impact. But I agree questions are better than statements. I took delight in pointing her to the passage in the Bible that talks about removing the 'nails' plural from Jesus' hands to show that the stake interpretation is inconsistent with the Bible. She was dumb-stuck but to no avail - mind you I am an atheist so I did feel a bit hypocritical.
Lisa Rose - don't feel bad about reading the Bible Stories book to your daughter - the Society uses parents as instruments to propagate their propaganda and applies a lot of emotional and psychological pressure on them to this effect. You sere a victim as my wife was a victim when she read it to my son. Luckily I worked out what was going on in time. I do feel that there must be a human rights/child protection angle to get the book banned. Unfortunately the Society is very practied at using 'Freedom of religion' as a sword to intimidate those who seek to curtail their indoctrination techiniques.
A Bible Student - I have done a lot of what you suggest particularly having fun together and with non-WJ friends and family but she has a habit of trying to sabotage such events and we are constantly late for such gatherings as she makes excuses - I am sure she received warnings about the risks of mixing with worldly people by haing a UBM. But when we get there she enjoys herself. She coudln't make it to a convention the other weekend because there were no trains to get her to the bus pick up point in time so I took her to Legoland one day and to a historic home and then shopping on the next day.
I hear you in relation to my son but I think I have that covered - my parents are academics and I was spoon fed critical thinking so I am instilling this in my son. I am always banging on about the importance of curiosity. So far the signs are all good in that direction.
I am not so sure about your advice re learning about investing. My wife has no money to invest and I have an applied finance degree (and invest very conservatively because I work for the local equivalent of the SEC so I know about fraud, which is why the fraud of the Society is so obvious because it has all the same trappings as a financial fraud including the fact that the victims of the fraud refuse to believe they have been conned even after we lay out all the evidence. It is also not surprising that lots of JWs have been victims fo fraud by other JWs - it never occurs to them they are being deceived. Still I thnk finding a hobby we can share is a very good idea.
I think this site will be incredibly useful for me to VENT - I have done so much research but am unable to share it with my wife so that without an outlet I think my head will explode. I feel like I have already done enough ranting but there is still so much still in my head.
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ex-jw-uk
by bigmac ini'm quite new to this site, & have realised some members have a union jack symbol under their avatar.
i don't.. could we have a "show of hands" from any uk members?
i've already found several by reading older posts..
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Frazzled UBM
I am in London and would really enjoy going to an ex-JW meetup but feel like a bit of a fraud having never been a JW myself - mine is only collateral damage. I have so much respect for you guys in having overcome the powerful forces keeping you in and exercising your right to think for yourselves. My experience with my wife let's me see how hard that must have been. I hope to meet you so that if and when my wife does fade she can talk to people who have been through it.
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How to stay married to a born-in JW?
by Frazzled UBM init is hard to work out where to begin.
i have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what i have got myself into but i alos have no intention of getting out.
i love my wife dearly but in the 9 years i ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married i have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the society is not what it claims to be but to no avail.
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Frazzled UBM
Thanks all - it was reassurring to realise that I ma doing a lot fo the things you suggest - so I am not getting it completely wrong. Off to wrok now but I will post more later. Cheers BTW - I am an Australian living in London
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21
How to stay married to a born-in JW?
by Frazzled UBM init is hard to work out where to begin.
i have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what i have got myself into but i alos have no intention of getting out.
i love my wife dearly but in the 9 years i ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married i have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the society is not what it claims to be but to no avail.
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Frazzled UBM
Thanks garyneal - useful advice
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21
How to stay married to a born-in JW?
by Frazzled UBM init is hard to work out where to begin.
i have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what i have got myself into but i alos have no intention of getting out.
i love my wife dearly but in the 9 years i ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married i have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the society is not what it claims to be but to no avail.
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Frazzled UBM
Thanks for that advice - I think staying silent will be the biggest challenge of my life but I am beginning to realize that waiting for her to come to me is the only way to go.
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I Just Had A Big Fat Bomb Drop On My Head and It Leaves Alot Of Questions
by TotallyADD inwhen i got home from work this afternoon my wife was standing near the door looking at me and said you need to sit down i have some hard news to tell you.
so i sat down and she began saying my brother called and i imminently ask if my mom had died.
she said no but my mother told my brother a deep family secrect that no one knows about.
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Frazzled UBM
Totally ADD (great tag BTW) _ I think there are two issues here - one is that your father was a bigger fraud than you realised - that is painful and something you need to work through and it seems you started with your full brother already. The second issue is whetehr you want to have a relationship with your half-brother, who I think someone already mentioned is .as iknnocent as you in the whole thing and probably similarly interested to know what his half-siblings are like. I think this is probably desirable but perhaps once you have worked through the issues related to your father. Anyway good luck with this.
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How to stay married to a born-in JW?
by Frazzled UBM init is hard to work out where to begin.
i have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what i have got myself into but i alos have no intention of getting out.
i love my wife dearly but in the 9 years i ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married i have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the society is not what it claims to be but to no avail.
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Frazzled UBM
It is hard to work out where to begin. I have been reading excerpts from this websikte for a long time and it along with a lot of the other sites have been incredibly helpful in helping me to understand what I have got myself into but I alos have no intention of getting out. I love my wife dearly but in the 9 years I ahve known her and the 2.5 years we ahve been married I have gone through the full gammit of emotions, trials and trbulations and tactics to try to get her to understand that the Society is not what it claims to be but to no avail. So I clearly need to change tack.
I seem to have solved one of my main issues, which was her attempts to indoctrinate our 7 year old son (if you did the maths you will note that he was conceived out of wedlock which means she was df'd for fornication so for a number of years we had no exposure to the religion though I did have some sense of how distraught she was when she got df'd and it was only after I did the right thing by her and we got married and she was allowed back in that the full horrow started to become apparent). Also I cannot but feel that the effect of the d'fing and reinstatement was to tighten the hold the Society has over her.
I quickly came to realize that the religion was malignant and not benign as I had first assumed. An analysis of "My Book of Bible Stories" made me realise the emotional and psychological manipulation (principally through fear) used to indoctrinate children who are too young to understand that what is presented as reality are no more than stories. Did you know that the dominant theme was that if you don't obey Jehovah you will be killed or seriously harmed - no less than 20 of the stories have this theme, of which 10 have graphic depictions of killing? Other themes inlcude obedience to Jehovah (11); women can't be trusted (6); satan and the demons influence worldly peole (4); you can live forever in a restored gareden of eden ruled by Jesus king (10); Jesus will end all badness on earth (2) and bring good dead people back to life (3); we do not want to make friends with people who do not obey God i.e. wordly people (the story of Dinah); keep watching (1); children should serve Jehovah and go to meetings and parents should teach (one of the most insidious aspects of the whole thing is the way the Society uses unwitting JW parents and the trust their children have in them as tools of indoctrination); and most important of all OBEY GOD'S SERVANTS!(1) - the only surprise was that it didn't appear more often but I expect as obedeince to Jehovah and obedience to the Society are merged this is not surprising. So I have exercised my headship rights and banned home study and her taking my son to the KH. I explained to him that the stories are just that and he was happy about that because those stories were scaring him, including the notion that I was going to get wiped out at Armageddon. I also explained that the people at the KH would be very nice to him as long as he agreed witht them and obeyed their rules but if not they could be very mean like they were to mummy when she was df'd. This seemed to strike a cord.
Anyway - I digress, the main issue I now have to contend with is the impact of the Society's emotional and psychological manipulation of my wife. Apart from the fact that her absence for a full day every Sunday and intermittently on week nights impacts on our family time and the fact that I can't always trust her because her first loyalty is to a bunch of old men in Bethel, I feel that as I care about her I need to save her from the fraud being perpetrated against her. I can see the emotional harm they have caused her whenever I ask her difficult questions or present uncomfortable information to her. She doesn't respond - she just breaks down. This is so uncomfortable for me I have stopped doing this but I am very uncomfortable with the silence she has imposed on me. The message I get from this is that she doesn't trust or respect my views and my concern for her well-being. But I can see my logical discourse approach is failing miserably so my question is whether anyone out there who has lived this can advise me on how best to proceed and have a happy marriage but not go crazy from the frustration of seeing my loved one controlled by this authoritarian organization. By the way - did I say that I love her? Well I do